Works of John Bunyan: A CASE OF CONSCIENCE RESOLVED; VIZ., AND THE ARGUMENTS MADE USE OF FOR THAT PRACTICE, EXAMINED. 910

 

Objection.

"But women have sometimes cases, which modesty will not admit should be made known to men; what must they do then?"

Answer.

Their husbands and they are one flesh, and are no more to be accounted two. Let them tell their grief to them. Thus Rachel asked the children of her husband, and went not to a nest of women to make her complaint to them (Gen 30:1). Or let them betake themselves to their closets, with Rebecca (Gen 25:20-23). Or if they be in the assembly of the saints, let them pray in their hearts, with Hannah. And if their petition be lawful, I doubt not, but they may be heard (1 Sam 1:13).

Our author, perhaps, will say, I have not spoken to his question; which was, "Whether women, fearing God, may meet to pray together? And whether it be lawful for them so to do?"

But I answer, I have: with respect to all such godly women as are in the churches of the saints (1 Cor 14:33-35 compared with vv 15-17). And when he has told us that his question respected only those out of churches, then will I confess that I did mistake him. Yet he will get nothing thereby, forasmuch as his question, to be sure, intends those in special. Also, his arguments are meant to justify their practice. Now the reason why I waved the form of his question was because it was both scanty and lean of words, as to the matter of the controversy in hand: also, I thought it best to make it more ample and distinct, for the edification of our reader. And if, after all, Mr. K. is not pleased at what I have done, let him take up the question and answer it better. The man, perhaps, may fly to the case of utter necessity, and so bring forth another question, to wit, whether, if the men of a church should all die, be murdered, or cast into prison, the women of that church may not meet together to pray? And whether it is not lawful for them so to do? But when he produceth a necessity for the putting of such a question, and then shall put it to me; I will, as God shall help me, give him an answer thereto.

But, may some say, our women in this do not do what they do of their own heads, they are allowed to do what they do by the church.

I answer, No church allowance is a foundation sufficient to justify that which is neither commanded nor allowed by the word. Besides, who knows not that have their eyes in their heads, what already has, and what further may come into the churches, at such a gap as this. And now to give the reader a cautionary conclusion.

Caution 1.

Take heed of letting the name, or good show of a thing, beget in thy heart a religious reverence of that thing; but look to the word for thy bottom, for it is the word that authorizeth, whatever may be done with warrant in worship to God; without the word things are of human invention, of what splendour or beauty soever they may appear to be. Without doubt, the Friars and Nuns, and their religious orders, were of a good intent at first, as also compulsive vows of chastity, single life, and the like. But they were all without the word, and therefore, as their bottom wanted divine authority, so the practice wanted sanctity by the Holy Ghost. The word prayer is, of itself, in appearance so holy, that he forthwith seems to be a devil that forbids it. And yet we find that prayers have been out of joint, and disorderly used; and therefore may by one, without incurring the danger of damnation, be called into question; and if found without order by him, he may labour to set them in joint again (Matt 6:5-8, 23:14; James 4:3).

I am not of the number of them that say, "What profit should we have if we pray unto God?" (Job 21:15). But finding no good footing in the word for that kind of service we have treated about above, and knowing that error and human inventions in religion will not offer themselves, but with wiped lips, and a countenance as demure as may be, and also being persuaded that this opinion of Mr. K. is vagrant, yea a mere alien as to the scriptures, I being an officer, have apprehended it, and put it in the stocks, and there will keep it, till I see by what authority it has leave to pass and repass as it lists, among the godly in this land.

Caution 2.

Yet by all that I have said, I never meant to intimate in the least, but that believing women are saints as well as men, and members of the body of Christ. And I will add that as they, and we, are united to Christ, and made members of his mystical body, the fullness of him that fills all in all, so there is no superiority, as I know of, but we are all one in Christ. For, the man is not without the woman, nor "the woman without the man, in the Lord," (1 Cor 11:11) nor are we counted "as male or female" in him (Gal 3:28; Eph 1:23). Only we must observe that this is spoken of that church which is his actual mystical body, and not of every particular congregation of professing Christians. The churches of Christ here and there are also called his body. But no church here, though never so famous, must be taken for that of which mention was made afore. As Christ then has a body mystical, which is called his members, his flesh, and his bones (Eph 5:30), so he has a body politic, congregations modelled by the skill that his ministers have in his word, for the bearing up of his name, and the preserving of his glory in the world against Antichrist. In this church, order and discipline, for the nourishing up of the true mystical body of Christ, has been placed from the foundation of the world. Wherefore in this, laws, and statutes, and government, is to be looked after, and given heed unto, for the edification of that which is to arrive at last to a perfect man: to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ (1 Cor 12:27-30; Eph 4:11-13).

Now, where there is order and government by laws and statutes, there must, of necessity, be also a distinction of sex, degrees, and age. Yeah, offices and officers must also be there for our furtherance and joy in the faith. From which government and rule our ordinary women are excluded by Paul; nor should it, since it is done by the wisdom of God, be any offence unto them.

In this church there are ofttimes many hypocrites, and formal professors, and heresies, "That they which are approved may be made manifest" (1 Cor 11:19). These therefore being there, and being suffered to act as they many times do, provoke the truly godly to contend with them by the word; for that these hypocrites, and formal professors, naturally incline to a denial of the power of godliness, and to set up forms of their own in the stead thereof (Mar 7:6-9; 2 Tim 3:5). And this is done for the sake and for the good of those that are the actual members of the body of Christ, and that are to arrive at his haven of rest: from whom those others at last shall be purged, and with them, all their things that offend. "Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear let him hear" (Matt 13:43).

Works of John Bunyan: A CASE OF CONSCIENCE RESOLVED; VIZ., AND THE ARGUMENTS MADE USE OF FOR THAT PRACTICE, EXAMINED. 909

 

Thus having taken from his arguments those holy words of God which he has abused, to make them stand; I come next to the arguments themselves, and intend to pick their bones for the crows.

1stly,

He saith, "That the same spirit that was in Miriam, is also in all God's servants for the same end, both to pray for mercies we stand in need of, and to praise God for mercies received."

Answer.

1. But the question is, whether Miriam did, as she led out the women to dance, act only as an ordinary saint. And if you evade this, you choose the tongue of the crafty, and use the words of deceit; for she managed that work as she was "Miriam the prophetess"; and in your next, pray tell your women so.

2. But as Miriam the prophetess, she did not lead the women from their men, to worship in some place remote by themselves, as we have shown before.

2dly, He saith, "That God hath promised to pour out his Spirit in gospel times to that very end, that women might pray together apart from men."

Answer.

1. Not mentioning again what was said before: I add, if by men, he means the brethren, the prophet will not be his voucher, for he neither saith nor intimates such a thing.

2. And how far short this saying is, of making of God and his holy prophet, the author of schism in worship, and an encouragement unto schism therein, it is best in time that he looks to it. For if they may withdraw to do thus at one time, they may withdraw to do thus at another. And if the Spirit is given to them to this very end, that they may go by themselves from the church, to perform this divine worship at one time, they may, for what bounds this man has set them, go by themselves to do thus always. But, as I said, the whole of this proposition being false, the error is still the greater.

3dly,

"God," saith he, "hath so well approved of women meeting together to pray in gospel times, as then, and at that time, to take occasion to make known his mind and will to them concerning Jesus Christ" (Acts 16:13).

Answer.

Let the reader consider what was said before, and now it follows; if this assertion be true, then the popish doctrine of merit is sound, yea, the worst sort of it, which is, works done before faith. For that, we read of none of these women save Lydia, who feared or worshipped God. Yet, saith he, God so approved of that meeting as then, and at that time, to send them his gospel, which is one of the richest blessings; nor will it help to lay Cornelius, now in my way, for the deservings here were, for ought we read, of women that feared not God. Here, Lydia only bore that character; it is said SHE worshipped God, but she was not all the women. But Mr. K. saith thus of them all. I know also there was faith in some in the Messiah to come, though when he came, they knew not his person; but this is not the case either; these women, who held up as he feigned, this meeting, were not as we read of, of this people.

4thly,

He said, "That Esther and her maids fasted and prayed, and the Lord gave a gracious return, or answer and deliverance." That is, to the church, which was then under the rage of Haman.

Answer.

Let the reader remember what was said before, and now I ask this man,

1. Whether Mordecai and the good men then did not pray and fast as well as she? And if so, whether they might not obtain at least some little of the mercy, as well as those women? If so,

2. Whether Mr. K., in applying the deliverance of this people to the prayer of the queen and her maids, for he lays it only there, be not deceitfully arguing, and do not tend to puff up that sex, to their hurt and damage! Yea, whether it doth not tend to make them unruly and headstrong? But if they are more gently inclined to obedience, no thanks to Mr. K.

3. And if I should ask Mr. K. who gave him authority to attribute thus the deliverance of this people, to whom and what prayers he please, I suppose it would not be easy for him to answer. The text saith not that the prayers of these women procured the blessing. But Mr. K. hath here a woman's meeting to vindicate, and therefore it is that he is thus out in his mind. Prayers were heard and the church was delivered. And I doubt not but that these good women had hand and heart in the work. But should all be admitted that Mr. K. hath said as to this also, yet this scripture, as hath already been proved, will not justify his woman's meeting.

5thly,

"He makes his appeal to the women, if they have not obtained, by their prayers in these their meetings, many blessed returns of prayer from God, both to themselves and the church of God."

Answer.

I count this no whit better than the very worst of his paper, for besides the silliness of his appeal, by which he makes these good women to be judges in their own cause, his words have a direct tendency in them to puff them up to their destruction. I have wondered sometimes, to see when something extraordinary hath happened to the church of God for good, that a few women meeting together to pray, should be possessed with a conceit, that they fetched the benefit down from heaven, when perhaps ten thousand men in the land prayed for the mercy as hard as they. Yeah, I have observed that though the things bestowed were not so much as thought of by them, yet they have been apt to conclude that their meeting together has done it. But poor women, you are to be pitied; your tempter is to bear the blame, to wit, this man and his fellows.

I come now to some objections that may yet be thought on, and will speak a word to them.

Objection.

It is said, "Where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them" (Matt 18:20).

Answer.

To gather together in Christ's name, is to gather together by his authority; That is, by his law and commandment (Acts 4:17,18,30, 5:28,40; Col 3:17). But we have no law of Christ, nor commandment, that the women of this or that church, should separate themselves from their brethren, to maintain meetings among themselves, for the performing of divine worship: and therefore such meetings cannot be in his name; that is, by his authority, law, and commandment; and so ought not to be at all.

Objection.

"But women may, if sent for by them of their own sex, come to see them when they are sick, and when so come together, pray in that assembly before they part."

Answer.

The law of Christ is, "Is any sick among you? Let him [and the woman is included in the man] call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him," &c. And to this injunction, there is a threefold promise made. (1.) "And the prayer of faith shall save the sick." (2.) "And the Lord shall raise him up." (3.) "And if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him" (John 5:14,15). And considering, that this advice is seconded with so much grace: I think it best in all such cases, as in all other, to make the word of God our rule.

Works of John Bunyan: A CASE OF CONSCIENCE RESOLVED; VIZ., AND THE ARGUMENTS MADE USE OF FOR THAT PRACTICE, EXAMINED. 908

 

Objection.

"Women were wont in gospel times to meet together to pray. Therefore, the women in gospel churches may separate themselves from their brethren to perform divine worship by themselves without their men" (Acts 16:13). This is another of his scriptures, brought to uphold this fancy: But,

Answer

1. It is not said that the women of churches met together alone to pray. But that Paul went down to a riverside where prayer was wont to be made, and spake unto the women that resorted thither. It looks most agreeable to the world to think that there the law was read by the Jewish priests to the proselyted women of that city, and that prayer, as was their custom in all such service, was intermixed therewith. But this is but conjectural. And yet, for all that, it is better grounded, and hath more reason on its side, than hath any of this man's arguments for the opinion of his women's meetings. But,

2. There was no gospel church of Christ at that time, nor before that any gospel ministry; consequently, no church obedience. Should it then be granted, that there were none but women at that meeting, and that their custom was to meet at that river-side to pray, it doth not therefore follow, that their practice was to be a pattern, a rule, a law to women in churches, to separate from their brethren, to perform divine worship, in their own woman's congregation without their men.

3. There was no gospel believer. Lydia herself, before Paul came thither, had her heart shut up against the faith of Jesus Christ. How a company of strangers to gospel faith should, in that their doing, be a pattern to the women in churches, a pattern of Christian worship, I do not understand.

4. If Paul's call to Philippi had been by the vision of a woman, or a woman's meeting: what an argument would this man have drawn from thence to have justified his women's meetings? But since it was by a man, he hath lost an argument thereby. Though he, notwithstanding, doth adventure to say, that God so approved of that meeting, as then, and at that time, to take advantage to make known his mind and will to them concerning Jesus Christ.

5. And now I am in, since Mr. K. will needs have this scripture to justify such a practice, I wonder that he so lightly overlooked Paul's going to that meeting, for thither he went to be sure (Acts 16:13-16). Yea, how fairly, to his thinking, might he have pleaded, that Paul, by this act of his, was a great lover, countenancer, and commender of those he calls the women's meetings. Paul went to the women's meeting at Philippi; therefore, it is lawful for the women of gospel churches to separate from their brethren and to congregate by themselves for the performance of some parts of divine worship. I say, how easily might he have said this, and then have popped in those two verses above, and so have killed the old one? For the word lies liable to be abused by the ignorance of men. It had been better than it is, if this had been the first time that this man had served it so, for the justification of his rigid principles; but when men, out of a fond conceit of their own abilities, or of prejudice to them that contradict their errors, are tempted to shew their folly, they will not want an opportunity from false glosses put upon the text, to do it.

6. But Paul went to that company to preach Christ's gospel to them, not for that they merited his coming, but of the grace of God, as also did Peter and John, when at the hour of prayer they went up into the temple, and Paul into the synagogue at Antioch (Acts 3:1-3, 13:14-16). But as reasonably might this man have urged, that the healing of the lame man that lay at that time at the gate of the temple, and the conversion of them by Paul at Antioch, was by the procurement of the prayers of the sisters and by their reading of the law in that synagogue at Antioch, as to argue as he has done, that God was so well pleased, or so well approved of that woman's meeting as he feigns it at Philippi, as to send, &c. to them his minister.

7. But again, that this woman's meeting should be so deserving, and that while they were without the faith of Christ, as to procure a gospel minister to be sent unto them, that Christ might to them be made known, and yet that so few of them should be converted to the faith, seems a greater paradox to me. For we read not that one of the women then, or of them of the town, that did use to go to that meeting (for Lydia was of Thyatira), was ever converted to Christ; brethren, we read of several, but we hear not of any one more of those women (v 40). But Lydia worshipped God; therefore, her practice might prevail. Although it is said she worshipped God, yet she was but a proselyte, as those in Acts 13 were, and knew no more of Christ than the eunuch did (Acts 8). But hold, she had faith, will that make all practice acceptable; yea, law and commandment to others, and the work of those that have none, meritorious? But we must touch upon these things anon.

Objection.

"But (saith Mr. K.) Malachi 3:16 doth countenance these meetings."

Answer.

Not at all; though Mr. K. has pleased to change a term in the text, to make it speak his mind; for he has put out thought, and put in call; but all will not do his work; for when he has done what he can, it will be challenging to make that scripture say, It is the duty of women in gospel churches to separate from their brethren, to perform divine worship among themselves.

Objection.

"But Jude 20 doth justify these meetings, except," saith he, "any will say, women are not to be built up in their most holy faith."

Answer. How faint would the man lie hold on something, only he wants divine help, that is, the word of God, to bottom his things upon. But doth the apostle here at all treat of the women and their meetings, or are they only the beloved; and to be built up, &c speaks he not there to the church, which consisteth of men and women? and are not men the more noble part in all the churches of Christ? But can women no other way be built up in their most holy faith, but by meetings of their own without their men? But building up YOURSELVES is what he holds by. But cannot the church, and every woman in it, build itself up without their woman's meetings? wherefore have they the word, their closet, and the grace of meditation, but to build up themselves withal? He saith not, "Build up one another," but if he had, it might well have been done without a woman's meeting. But anything to save a drowning man. This text then is written to the church of Christ, by which it is exhorted to faith and prayer; but it speaks not a word of a woman's meeting, and therefore it is fooling with the word to suggest it. I cannot therefore, while I see this impertinent dealing, but think our argumentator dotes, or takes upon him to be a head of those he thinks to rule over. The woman's letter to me also seems to import the same, when they say, "Mr. K. would desire to know what objections you have against it (his arguments), and he is ready to give his further advice."

Works of John Bunyan: A CASE OF CONSCIENCE RESOLVED; VIZ., AND THE ARGUMENTS MADE USE OF FOR THAT PRACTICE, EXAMINED. 907

 

Objection.

Esther, the queen, performed, with her maidens, this duty of prayer, without their men. Therefore, the women of gospel churches may separate themselves from their brethren and perform it among themselves (Esth 4:16).

Answer.

1. Esther was in the house of the king's chamberlain, and could not at this time come to her brethren; No, not to her uncle, Mordecai, to consult how to prevent an approaching judgment. Yeah, she and Mordecai were fain to speak one to another by Hatach, whom the king had appointed to attend upon the queen (vv 5-9). So she could by no means, at that time, have communion with the church. No marvel, therefore, if she fasted with her maidens alone: for so she must now do, or not do it at all. But I will here ask this, our argumentator, whether Esther did count it a burden or a privilege thus now to be separated from her brethren, and so forced to perform this work as she did? If a privilege, let him prove it. If a burden, he has little cause to make use of it to urge that her practice then, for a ground to women that are at liberty, to separate from their brethren to perform such worship by themselves in their company, without their men.

2. We do not read that she desired that any of the women who were at liberty should come from the men to be with her; whence we may gather that she preferred their freedom to worship with men, far beyond a woman's meeting. She counted that too many, by herself and her maidens, were in such bondage already.

3. Neither did she attempt to take that unavoidable work upon herself, but as begging of the men that she might, by their faith and prayers, be borne up therein; clearly concluding that she did count such work too hard for women to perform by themselves, without the help of men (vv 15,16).

4. Besides this woman's meeting, as Mr. K. would have it, was made up of none but the queen and her household maids, and with but few of them; nor will we complain of our honest women when the case is so that they cannot go out to the church to do this, if they pray with their maids at home.

5. But what if Esther did pray with her maids in her closet, because she could not come out to her brethren? Is it fair to make the necessity of a woman in bondage a law to women at liberty? This argument, therefore, is erroneous, and must not have this text to show it up; we therefore take it away from his words and proceed to a sight of his next.

Objection.

But the prophet Zechariah says that, in New Testament times, the Spirit is promised to be given to women so they may pray together apart from men (Zech 12:11-13).

Answer. The text says nothing, but this man abuses it greatly. Indeed, it says their wives shall mourn apart, but it saith not, they shall do so together. Yea, that they shall separate themselves by the dictate of God, from their brethren, to do so, is that which this text knows nothing of. Sometimes many may be together, apart from others; but why Mr. K., to serve his purpose, should rack and strain this text to justify his woman's meeting, I see no reason at all. My reason against him is, for that the look here upon him whom we have pierced, which is to be the cause of this mourning, is to be by an immediate revelation of the Holy Ghost, who doth not use to tell beforehand when he will so come down upon us. But such a meeting as Mr. K. intends must be the product of consultation and time. "I will pour," saith God, "upon the house of David—the spirit of grace and of supplications: and then they shall look"; that is, when that spirit so worketh with them as to enable them so to do. Now, I say, I would know, since this mourning is to be the effect of this look, and so before one is aware (Cant 6:12), whether Mr. K. can prove that these women were to have an item beforehand, when they should have this look. But as it would be ridiculous thus to conclude, so absurd is it to think to prove his women's meetings from hence.

Nor doth the conclusion that he hath made hereupon prove more but that he is ignorant of the work of the Spirit in this matter, or that his fondness for the women's meetings hath made him forget his own experience. For how can one who never had but one such look upon Jesus Christ, draw such a conclusion from hence? And that all those women should have this look at the same time, even all the women of the house of David and of the inhabitants of Jerusalem, that they might, all of them, by the direction of the Holy Ghost, separate themselves from their men to hold a woman's meeting or meetings by themselves for this, is more fictitious than one would imagine a man should dream. If he says that the women have a promise to have this look when they please, or that they are sure to have it because it is entailed to THEIR meeting, for this seems to come nearest his conclusion. Yet, what unavoidable inconveniences will flow therefrom, I leave to any to judge. 

But I take this mourning to be according as another of the prophets says, "They shall be on the mountains like doves of the valleys, all of them mourning, every one for his iniquity" (Eze 7:16). All those souls, therefore, that shall be counted worthy to have this look shall mourn apart, or by themselves, when they have it. For though a man cannot appoint to himself when he will repent of his sins, or when the Holy Ghost will work, yet he shall repent indeed; he shall do it, I say, when HE doth so work, not staying till another can do so too. And since our own iniquity will then make us best consider our own case, mourning apart, or everyone for their own iniquity, is most naturally proper thereto. And this is the mourning that shall be in the house of David, Jerusalem, the church, both with men and women, at all times when the Holy Ghost shall help us to look upon him whom we have pierced. Pray God give Mr. K. and myself more of these looks upon a crucified Christ, for then we shall understand this and other such like scriptures otherwise than to draw such incoherent inferences from them as he doth.